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 Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?

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DavidStrides

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Game username : DavidStrides
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Join date : 2014-12-29
Age : 19
Location : Dirk's Apartment

PostSubject: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:23 pm

Hello everyone, a little discussion here about new IT server members who want to make a game but don't want to do any of the work or haven't really tried. I'm sure I'm not the only one who's went to a forum and saw that the owner was asking for a game maker and not trying to make the game themselves. (Or not attempting at all) I'd like to discuss here what everyone thinks about this type of arrangement and if you think it's an alright thing to do or not.

I personally don't think it's a right thing to do if the person they are asking to code the whole entire game isn't getting some type of actual payment. They should be rewarded for their hard work with something that actually amounts to what they did, unlike Staff positions. I feel that a lot of new servers now a days choose to simply be the 'owner' and yet do none of the work or pay others for their hard work. I've seen it several times and I've always wondered what other people think when seeing that as well.

So, how do you see these kinds of things or what do you think of them?

((If this has already been made a discussion before I can ask for this to be deleted, sorry if this is also the wrong place for something like this.))
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FagonStar

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Game username : FagonStar
Server : Impressive Whatchamacallit
Female Posts : 1060
Join date : 2011-09-20
Location : In your closet.

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:21 pm

Personally, I think it's okay if you're paying them a fair amount and don't take credit for their hard work.
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DavidStrides

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Game username : DavidStrides
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Join date : 2014-12-29
Age : 19
Location : Dirk's Apartment

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:36 pm

FagonStar wrote:
Personally, I think it's okay if you're paying them a fair amount and don't take credit for their hard work.



    Understandable. That's how I see it, if they don't get any credit or get some sort of payment for it then I don't really see why they joined up with them. I've seen a few that don't list the programmer/co-owner at all in any credits on the forum or game but the Owner never did any coding and such to help. If said programmer/Co-owner made the game all by themselves then it's their game and the owner of the forum is only owner of said forum. They never had involvement with the game so I don't see the point in them getting such a title on something that isn't even theirs if they didn't put work behind what they did.
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Cloud
Texture Artist
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Game username : Cloud, Daydream
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Female Posts : 614
Join date : 2014-07-22
Location : Under your bed

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:53 pm

Agreed. People who command others to do create the game for them do not deserve the rank 'owner'.
You know all those big game companies like Star Stable Entertainment and Sony Online Entertainment create such nice games? They work together and create the models and animations themselves and there isn't one person commanding everyone else and not helping out.
(RIP Free Realms)

Servers that do this are like dictatorships. There is one person who commands everyone else, but doesn't help out in the projects they ask for. They have other people do their dirty work.

Owning a server isn't about the aura and the title and the so-called 'fame' you get. You'll have rulebreakers to deal with, people asking you consistent questions, etc. And you don't get any experience if you do nothing to create the game itself. Though my server is private, I do most of the work developing it, creating textures and using free models I find, crediting those who made free things, etc. I also create polls on the forum often to find out what those who are invited to play want for the next update.

When my server started on my friend's roleplay forum, I volunteered myself as coder as I was the preset maker of the group, and I knew my way around material files best (though I still can't code lol). From there on, everyone else nominated me as owner, and I took on the job. I downloaded the two programs needed and the source, and I used the guides and tutorials and I did it myself. Sure, I asked for help on here occasionally, but I didn't ask someone else to create the entire thing for me. I still ask for help (in fact I have a texture problem right now) but I am more knowledgeable and able to help others because of my experience creating my game. Those who just make others do it for them, are not experienced and will not have a good future as a game developer if they do so.

//pops out
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GlaciaTheWolf
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Game username : Glacia, GlaciaIceWolf, GlaciaTheWolf
Server : DD (member) Wolf soul (member)
Female Posts : 1001
Join date : 2013-12-09
Age : 21
Location : Ohio

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:39 pm

You want to own a server, you do the work, thats how i see it. Maybe you need help with something you are weak at like modeling, but you can texture, that is ok, I do nearly ALL of my servers work myself, I dont like my animal models, so i hire, or pay someone to make some animal models with a UV map, then i can do the rigging, animating and textures.
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FagonStar

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Game username : FagonStar
Server : Impressive Whatchamacallit
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Join date : 2011-09-20
Location : In your closet.

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:53 pm

Technically, you are the server owner even if you make other people do the work. Because, you originally created it and didn't transfer ownership to anyone else. You're just a terrible and lazy owner if you try to make other people do all the work.

You especially own it if you paid for the work.
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DavidStrides

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Game username : DavidStrides
Server : None
Male Posts : 49
Join date : 2014-12-29
Age : 19
Location : Dirk's Apartment

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 8:38 pm

Cloud wrote:
Agreed. People who command others to do create the game for them do not deserve the rank 'owner'.
You know all those big game companies like Star Stable Entertainment and Sony Online Entertainment create such nice games? They work together and create the models and animations themselves and there isn't one person commanding everyone else and not helping out.
(RIP Free Realms)

Servers that do this are like dictatorships. There is one person who commands everyone else, but doesn't help out in the projects they ask for. They have other people do their dirty work.

Owning a server isn't about the aura and the title and the so-called 'fame' you get. You'll have rulebreakers to deal with, people asking you consistent questions, etc. And you don't get any experience if you do nothing to create the game itself. Though my server is private, I do most of the work developing it, creating textures and using free models I find, crediting those who made free things, etc. I also create polls on the forum often to find out what those who are invited to play want for the next update.

When my server started on my friend's roleplay forum, I volunteered myself as coder as I was the preset maker of the group, and I knew my way around material files best (though I still can't code lol). From there on, everyone else nominated me as owner, and I took on the job. I downloaded the two programs needed and the source, and I used the guides and tutorials and I did it myself. Sure, I asked for help on here occasionally, but I didn't ask someone else to create the entire thing for me. I still ask for help (in fact I have a texture problem right now) but I am more knowledgeable and able to help others because of my experience creating my game. Those who just make others do it for them, are not experienced and will not have a good future as a game developer if they do so.

//pops out

Yeah, you'll have a lot more responsibilities and handling those responsibilities in the wrong way can lead to a rather bad reputation for the most part. A lot of people who join servers now a days only join to become a moderator or admin. I've seen that on almost any server I've gotten on, I don't play IT server's often if rarely anymore, but the ones I have checked out have members who are a little more than power hungry.

For my server, the first one I've ever worked on or have been an owner of, I'm working on the coding. Me and my Co-Owner have been working very hard together. We worked on our forum for days as a team and finally finished that and now while I'm working on learning the coding and making our server she's learning how to do textures, make models, etc. Which is what I'll be learning soon after I create and manage to hold up a successful server of our own. I don't like the idea of mooching off other people and I feel that if I truly wanted someone else to help us that I would wait until I have currency to pay them. If I can learn and do those things for myself then I feel I must try my hardest before I decide to go down that route but I think they make very good business out of doing things like that for people who need help and are willing to do what it takes to get it rather than just ask for someone to make the game and give nothing in return.

FagonStar wrote:
Technically, you are the server owner even if you make other people do the work. Because, you originally created it and didn't transfer ownership to anyone else. You're just a terrible and lazy owner if you try to make other people do all the work.

You especially own it if you paid for the work.

Well, I know that. What I meant was technically if the owner didn't do any work on it at all, didn't pay, or help and assume it would be handed freely to them then it would be considered the person's who made it. Now, if they paid for it then I must agree, then it is theirs or if they helped then it is theirs to do what they please with as they are the owner. Though I still feel like credit should be given in some way.


Last edited by DavidStrides on Wed Apr 22, 2015 8:49 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Adding more to it.)
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GlaciaTheWolf
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Game username : Glacia, GlaciaIceWolf, GlaciaTheWolf
Server : DD (member) Wolf soul (member)
Female Posts : 1001
Join date : 2013-12-09
Age : 21
Location : Ohio

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 8:42 pm

FagonStar wrote:
Technically, you are the server owner even if you make other people do the work. Because, you originally created it and didn't transfer ownership to anyone else. You're just a terrible and lazy owner if you try to make other people do all the work.

You especially own it if you paid for the work.

Thats true, but in my opinion, i couldn't say i owned something such as an IT server if i did none of the work.
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Vιrus
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Game username : Virus
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Female Posts : 486
Join date : 2014-09-05
Age : 17
Location : deep in an existential crisis

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 9:04 pm

Though you may still be considered the owner if you get everyone else to do the work for you, you most definitely wouldn't be a proud owner.
I've worked on my server and I've been the only one truly working on it. The only thing that someone else is doing is the hosting, and even that was offered to me.
And now that it's close to completion, I can take a step back to look at it and go "wow, I really did do all of this myself".
It's a general feeling of pride when you look at your server and acknowledge that you worked on it by yourself. I don't think you receive that same great feeling when someone else does it for you, regardless if you love the work.
And plus it means you're a truly devoted and dedicated owner.
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Icea

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Game username : Icea
Server : Blazing Wolves (Co-Owner), Tales of Luzaris (Moderator) Canis Lupus (Mapmaker)
Female Posts : 195
Join date : 2015-02-09
Age : 15
Location : Canada

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 10:04 pm

Honestly, I think owners that dont do anyhing to build their server and expect someone else to are lazy. Yes, im lazy myself, but I actually compiled myself a private server and I asked for help when I needed it. So, basically im not open for compile requests nor will I request for someone to build me a server. Like, seriously, some people just have to get visual studio's "trial" version and TRY building a server, come on! Its EASY!

these were my thoughts.
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FagonStar

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Game username : FagonStar
Server : Impressive Whatchamacallit
Female Posts : 1060
Join date : 2011-09-20
Location : In your closet.

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 10:12 pm

DavidStrides wrote:
Though I still feel like credit should be given in some way.

Yessss. I really can't stress it enough that credit is a necessary thing.

Anyway, I personally feel that an owner who makes other people do everything and doesn't even pay them really just has a useless title. But people who expect everything to be done for them(for free) don't really get anywhere anyway. ^^ And rightfully so too. I feel like it shouldn't be how many or what server(s) you own, it should be what you did or created for the server(s) or community. c:
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ShadoWolfozo

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Game username : ShadoWolfozo
Server : GROWL: Spirits
Male Posts : 875
Join date : 2012-01-22
Age : 22
Location : Australia

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 11:39 pm

I think the thing people often forget is that, you don't have to be able to do everything- just enough for people to be bothered helping you by seeing you're doing stuff yourself.

But in general, even if your paying people, if you are doing shit all then I question why you think you would be a good server owner.

Prior to everyone and their dog being able to compile, you joined a server that was already well set up and you worked your ass off to get noticed with your skills. And eventually, you got a shot at joining a team. From there, you got better and better.

Now people just skip steps 1 to 11 and go straight to step 12 and then stop and see no one wants to help someone who skipped all the important parts. And earning respect and a reputation in KITO is one of those steps.

I mean how do you think, what some people call the 'IT Veterans', got to where they are now? Some of us have our own servers, some of us can do amazing things with models, maps, presets, etc, some of us have moved onto better games or jobs. We didn't just wake up one morning and have it all given to us, we worked for it. And we worked hard.

And it's not even just us IT Vets, it's all the other people that joined in on the fun afterwards and now can boast (if they so choose) how much they've improved and the level of their skills.
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--Infintiy--
3D Modeler
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Game username : --Infinity--
Server : Ferals Online BR {Owner}
Male Posts : 140
Join date : 2011-10-10
Age : 26
Location : Brazil

PostSubject: Re: Servers that expect someone else to do everything for them?   Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:04 am

I have a IT server called ITBR for over 6 years open, for this time I have 24/15 players online per day, when I open it after the close of ITR, I just want play IT I don't care where is going to be or what I gonna have in the game, and my friends to, well in the begin I become a very bad admin people hate me, but with time I learn to do the things right and put the game ahead, I learn to work with people together for this, today I'm doing my best to make my server very awesome for everyone, and I release the stuff I made here to, today my players just love, I receive a lot of thanks in the Facebook and forum community, like the players when I play IT i get very bored nothing to do in the game because of this I change my game a lot to make it fun for people, today I got a staff 6 players of the game that make textures and work for make the game fun to, but probably was me who did must of the job.

in the begin when kito open I expect here everyone is gonna made one single and the best IT server of all to play together, but what everyone really want is be the owner of your only server, I still imagine if everyone just forget your servers and start to work together in one single game imagine how far we can go :3 BAH just a dream
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