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 New People Expecting to be able to Create Fantastic Servers Overnight Need to Take a Step Back

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Do you think what has been said in the OP is fair?
Yes, it is fair and I agree
91%
 91% [ 21 ]
It is mostly fair, but I don't agree with everything you've said (what don't you agree with ?)
9%
 9% [ 2 ]
This isn't fair but I still agree with some points (like ?)
0%
 0% [ 0 ]
This isn't fair at all and I don't agree with anything (why ?)
0%
 0% [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 23
 

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ShadoWolfozo

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Game username : ShadoWolfozo
Server : GROWL: Spirits
Male Posts : 875
Join date : 2012-01-22
Age : 22
Location : Australia

PostSubject: New People Expecting to be able to Create Fantastic Servers Overnight Need to Take a Step Back   Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:57 am

You know, I'm all for people trying to learn new things, trying to push their boundaries, etc etc... but damn guys, take it a bit slower- don't rush yourself, you just end up frustrated (and quite frankly, 9/10 times now on KITO, you frustrate everyone else for asking the same question that's been answered 14,000 times before because you can't seem to use the search function).



This has forever been an issue on KITO and I've been trying to find a way to explain the problem and a solution for aaaaages without just coming off as rude and snobby, but I kind of realised there's no other way to put it.

There are an awful lot of new people on KITO who come here after playing a different game and hearing about KITO and being able to make their own game, who just expect they can create their own version straight off the bat with no problems, no hassles overnight.

...and then they discover it's not quite that simple. No #%^! Sherlock.

They have problems, they have issues, they crash, they this, they that- because they have absolutely no idea what they're doing (and clearly can't follow the gazillion and one tutorials we have on here that some of us spent HOURS putting together for YOUR convenience) and then expect us to just make it for them. And then those who do manage to get as far as building their server, often have no idea how to run it, have no staff because no one knows them and resort to theft and giving away high ranked positions like candy in attempts to get attention.

This is just... just no, okay? Bad. Not the way to go.


There are, of course, those who legitimately try very, very hard. They've been in the community for a long time, they've helped on other servers or provided content freely, they've observed how different servers are run, they've made a lot of friends within the community, friends with other staff, with members, they get a good idea on what is good and what is not and basically have earned some respect from most everyone. They are aware it's difficult to create their own game, but they are also willing to try their hardest until they succeed and actually read the tutorials. Then when they successfully build it, they are friendly, supportive and ask for help on things like models and textures (AND NOT CODING OR HOSTING) to build the game in a unique way- in a way that people actually feel like they want to help them. Not in a way that comes off as super rude, attention seeking or just plain desperate.

I'm all for these guys, good on you, you're doing great, thumbs up and everything Wink

Why can't everyone be like this?


So the point of this thread is to point out the faults in all the new people expecting to create servers overnight, but I also notice, apart from the usual sarcastic remark from a couple ITVets every now and then, and comments off-Kito, no one else has any opinions on this.

So, share your opinions or suggestions on the topic at hand, whether it's suggestions for what new people should expect or should actually learn/do first, or whether it's just a comment on my little rant. Maybe you don't agree with me at all? Maybe you don't mind seeing the same question asked 14,000 times or people asking for their server to be created for them 12,000 times. No? Well, each to his own.

I mean to be completely honest, I doubt this will even make a dent in changing anything ever... but what the hell.

Discuss!
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ObeyTheFist

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Game username : ObeyTheFist
Server : Dragon's Den
Female Posts : 514
Join date : 2012-09-07
Location : Australia

PostSubject: Re: New People Expecting to be able to Create Fantastic Servers Overnight Need to Take a Step Back   Sat Aug 16, 2014 5:46 am

I hate seeing/getting asked the same questions 50 million times. That's what tutorials, instructions and FAQs are for!!! >_< Seriously, people need to look around and read before they ask!

Lazyzim and I started off on FeralHeart. It didn't take me long to become curious about where FH started and I soon found out about IT. It was shut, but I found ITr and we joined that. It shut down shortly after and we found IW back near its starting days.

On IW Lazy and I decided to see what we could do. We wanted our own little place to play so we went and searched up a bunch of map tutorials. We started with a rather basic landscape that I eventually started getting more creative with (although terrain masks confused me back then. We had a pool, pond and river full of grassy terrain. XD).

We learnt how to add objects to this map and then to add a critter list. We put Salmon in a roam area in the water, added Red Pandas and Hawks. We added the cherry blossom tree from Shadow Veldt and managed to get the petal particle in there too.

Then we made Dragons Den map and released it to the public.

Then we left IW and went to SoE, when it first started, where we continued to practise our map making. We starting playing around with particles and created our Thunderbolts. Then we learned about critters and their textures and material scripting. I finally learnt, with some help, about terrain masks.

We decided to try and use all of our gathered knowledge to make our own server. We read through the tutorials, got stuck a few times and asked for help...but we did it after 6 weeks.

After 2 years we are still learning and improving. (I like to think we are anyway. XD)

So to all of you who want to start your own server...

Start small somewhere first. I suggest map-making. If you can get past making a decent map then you're off to a good start. Just make sure the server you try this on allows custom maps etc.

Little steps people. You'll still get there, but you'll get the proper chance to learn about all the flowers along the side of the road.

~Obey~
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FagonStar

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Server : Impressive Whatchamacallit
Female Posts : 1060
Join date : 2011-09-20
Location : In your closet.

PostSubject: Re: New People Expecting to be able to Create Fantastic Servers Overnight Need to Take a Step Back   Sat Aug 16, 2014 10:01 pm

I really don't want to come off as complain-y but... one thing that consistently gets on my nerves is people not reading the dang forums. If you have the ability to make a server, then I don't think reading existing topics and forum/board rules should be a problem. But so often there are people who make topics that ask for help with the AD1 Error, or they need staff for everything or they need a hoster(who can code really good)! One of my main issues with this is that, not only is it annoying, but asking for help for pre-existing issues only buries the obscure ones. Also I don't think that the rules for the "Got skills? Looking for talent?" could be anymore clear than they already are and people seem to refuse to listen to them. Then there's the people who can't freaking post a thread in the right place...

So I do have a suggestion to those looking to make a server, read things through and read them carefully. Chances are that most of the mistakes you're making are the results of mis-reading something. Also, learn to be patient, a little patience really can go a long way... oh and sometimes you just need to do things yourself instead of relying on others. Trust me, if you do it yourself it's almost guaranteed to get done. (:
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Casting

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Server : Miskai
Female Posts : 114
Join date : 2013-11-23
Location : USA/Hungary

PostSubject: Re: New People Expecting to be able to Create Fantastic Servers Overnight Need to Take a Step Back   Sun Aug 17, 2014 12:02 am

I've seen people recently posting, "I need staff for my server to create items and host" and I literally *FacePalm* That is NOT the way to do things. You'll need to learn the basics of being an Owner of a game and have AT LEAST a few skills. No one wants to do the work for you if you're just going to sit and say, "I'm the boss".

It took me and still is taking me 3 years to learn particle making and converting stuff in-game, but I already knew a bunch of Programming and Digital skills. I've read over KITO guides 1,000,000,000,000 times until I said, "Ok, I'm ready" and created a newborn server. Now we are heading to success. Every day I'm learning new things and recently learned map-making and more HTML knowledge.

Only rarely are there any servers heading for success if the "Owner" doesn't do anything. In fact, that server will one day fall if the "creator" doesn't bother.

There is honestly not much to say about this topic since ShadoWolfozo pretty much explained everything I would've said.


So guys, get off your video games and do some learning. There is YouTube, Google, Bing, Yahoo answers, etc. There are many options to choose from. Some might learn quicker then they think. I thought map-making will be difficult to learn but I managed to create about 5 maps within one day of learning. Awesome right? Well you can do the same, just find a topic that best fits your interest and keep trying. Giving up doesn't help.
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Revaen
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Male Posts : 314
Join date : 2013-07-21
Age : 16

PostSubject: Re: New People Expecting to be able to Create Fantastic Servers Overnight Need to Take a Step Back   Sun Aug 17, 2014 1:27 am

I believe I must agree not only with the added here by the first partisans but too disagree.

Lot of people can be very imprudent, specially, for these situations and when they're new to something in general.
But, you guys may mention me if you haven't at least do something like this before? And, who was there for help you everytime with all your questions even if that "master"  for you knew you where just repeating the same solved questions?


KITO is a support forum, mostly than all.This mean, people come and know at the first check that this forum and his community will help you no matter what.


This is a point of why sadly, mostly of the people will just come for support and help without want to know something else out, just the answer to their issue.

It's like the school:if you're new, teachers are gonna give the answer and teach you, no matter if it's the 50 million time they have solved the same thing.
I mean, schools are not like "Welcome, we have already explained the things to 5 people in here check their fix and look for them even if they're greedy and don't want help you.Our people with already the solution are not giving you information except for that 5 guys".


Even, the creation of various threads with a variety of answers and small differences and details of the issue makes bigger the branch of solutions,fixes and types of related issues.


As well, this new people is not PERFECT, they will do failures because having not experience in the community before.You can't force someone to do things they don't even know or do things as you are doing now that you have more experience that them.


These situations will always come in all support forums, people tends to act like that because being new.


A possible help for them that I could suggest to make every each solution and their question or issue in a more complete F.A.Q in the support place, or just, stick already solved issues for allow people find them faster!


Out of that, I must agree at the point that if what they want is to learn new things, they must put effort, patience and tenaceous on it, things are not magical.
Yes, it is really silly see how people say "I want learn do this", "I want learn do that", "help me learn do this, plz" lot of times, but tutorials are there with their link for just simply show them what to find out.


You actually get more prestige for showing them the same tutorial more times that leave their question in blank and close it...but well, it too depends in the tutorial's order and clear.You won't help someone to learn something if there's not tutorials or they're so uncompleted.


If you want someone to be like as you want to, just show them how to be to even if that means to each every of them different metods. (:

Thank you for sharing this, Shad.I really had fun reading and thinking in the things, but, we can't do still nothing for make them be perfect at the arriving of the forum.

-Lexka
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Draak
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PostSubject: Re: New People Expecting to be able to Create Fantastic Servers Overnight Need to Take a Step Back   Sun Aug 17, 2014 4:48 am

Making a FAQ is a great idea, however.....

Chances are if people don't bother to read a post that's not even 2 or 3 positions under theirs that contains the very answer to their question (bonus if the thread title matches/similar to theirs), they won't bat an eye at said FAQ.

People still flat out ignore the posts: KITO does NOT support " Serverless Staff Labor Herding" and the "Don't ask for free hosting".

Also just...people who don't take their time to read, probably don't even deserve having a server.
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FagonStar

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Server : Impressive Whatchamacallit
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Join date : 2011-09-20
Location : In your closet.

PostSubject: Re: New People Expecting to be able to Create Fantastic Servers Overnight Need to Take a Step Back   Sun Aug 17, 2014 5:33 am

Draak wrote:
Making a FAQ is a great idea, however.....

Chances are if people don't bother to read a post that's not even 2 or 3 positions under theirs that contains the very answer to their question (bonus if the thread title matches/similar to theirs), they won't bat an eye at said FAQ.

People still flat out ignore the posts:  KITO does NOT support " Serverless Staff Labor Herding" and the "Don't ask for free hosting".

Also just...people who don't take their time to read, probably don't even deserve having a server.
Very well said Draak. c:

Although I think I should point out to both above posters that there actually is an FAQ.

http://www.kitopen.com/t2340-mega-list-of-faq-tutorials-and-server-help It also contains tutorials and various other pieces of useful information.

If people can't take the time to notice the FAQ or the thread just below that already answers their question, then maybe they shouldn't be making a server. |:>
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